Published by Lindsey Hoff on 24 Mar 2008 at 09:17 am
Negotiating: It Never Hurts To Ask
This is Lindsey’s first post. Lindsey is a wedding planner and for some reason decided she wanted to marry me!
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| Never say NO to Fluffy! |
Recently, my husband John and I bought an investment property. While going through the renovation process I learned from him it never hurts to ask for something even if you think the answer will be no.
Every time a new contractor would come in to do something he would ask them to also do something else (without charging any extra). Since he was willing to do this we were able to get a lot of things done for nothing that would have added up to a lot of additional money out of our pockets.
What you need to keep in mind whether it be dealing with contractors, sales people or other entrepreneurs is that you need to know what you want before you talk to them. Have a game plan ready, know where you are going to start and what compromises you are willing to make.
For our investment property, we mapped out a timeline and budget. The problem was to fix up the house the way we wanted, we would have to spend well over our budget or do the work ourselves but sacrifice our timeline.
To solve this dilemma, John talked a little with each contractor that walked through our door and got to know a little about them.
For example, he discovered the mold removal contractor had a spray texture gun he used whenever he had to patch holes in walls he tore through to get to mold.
By asking this contractor to spray a few extra areas while he had the gun out we saved a couple hundred dollars.
Remember that not only are you trying to get a good deal but the person you are dealing with is trying to make a profit. Don’t insult them by asking for too much or offering to little. However, if you think that the request is reasonable hold your ground. If they will not give in to your request, walk away.
If, however, you are being reasonable then you can be sure there is someone else that’ll be willing to work within your requests and budget.
Also, if there is a contract involved (like when buying a new car) make sure that anything that you are able to negotiate is on the contract, even if it’s just written in and initialed by you and the other party.
Unfortunately, not everyone can just be taken at their word; my husband learned that the hard way.
Negotiating is a skill. It can be used every day and if you know the proper ways to use it whether you are a business owner or a consumer, you can benefit from it.
Do you have any tips for being a successful negotiator? Let us know.
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24 Responses to “Negotiating: It Never Hurts To Ask”
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James Chartrand - Men with Pens
on 24 Mar 2008 at 11:01 am #
Yes. Yes, yes, yes. You’ll never get anything if you don’t ask. I ask all the time - I ask questions, I ask for help, I ask for extras… The worst that can happen is no, and the best that can happen is I get something out of it, whether it be a perk or knowledge.
My mother, from the Silent Generation, never asks. She never asks a car lot to lower the price. She never asks her doctor additional information on her ailment. She never asks for a deal or asks about references or asks for help. She is truly silent.
She thinks I’m shameless - and definitely not proud. I believe the opposite is true. I am proud and confident enough to know that there’s no harm in asking and everything to gain.
My last car? I got $2,000 off the asking price, four brand new winter tires, the coolant for air conditioning topped up and a free wash job. It took me three visits and overall, about 5 hours of schmoozing, chitchatting, grinning and playing every card I had up my sleeve, but worth it? Oh yeah.
The dealer still shakes his head and chuckles every time he sees me.
John Hoff
on 24 Mar 2008 at 2:30 pm #
Don’t even get me started on car dealerships!!! Grrrr!
Lindsey
on 24 Mar 2008 at 2:32 pm #
I find it hard to ask the flooring guys if they can install the over the range microwave too…he has no problem doing that.
We both need a little help when it comes to car dealerships but I have a feeling the next car we buy we will not get “taken for a ride” like we have been in the past! Maybe we will have you come help.
I don’t think asking for things makes you “shameless” it makes you smart. Choosing to not ask makes you a sucker. The first numbers are just a starting point for further negotiations.
John Hoff
on 24 Mar 2008 at 3:04 pm #
@ James - Yes I too always ask and like you said, it doesn’t hurt and most people will say yes just to be nice.
In our last renovation, I think I got the mold guy to install a complicated light fixture, the carpet guys to install our microwave, the tile guy to do some door work, the window washer to remove our beat up shutters two stories high, the painter to paint the kitchen cabinets, the granite counter company to throw in the plumbing, the gas company tech to hook a few extra things up, and a few other things.
Again, like you said, it never hurts to ask. I saved a lot of money for just not being shy.
@ Lindsey - don’t get me started on car dealerships!
Lindsey
on 24 Mar 2008 at 3:09 pm #
Harrison McLeod
on 24 Mar 2008 at 10:02 pm #
Next time buy a motorcycle.
@Lindsey (aka: Mrs. eVentureBiz): Welcome to the blogosphere! *christens first post with a rather expensive bottle of champagne*
I used to not ask either. Sometimes I will, but overall, I still hate negotiating.
Take for example, the trip I took to Mexico some years ago with my then wife. Talk about a negotiator’s paradise! At first it was fun haggling with the locals for the lowest deal possible. My wife, a saleswoman, negotiated everywhere. I’m surprised she didn’t negotiate with the waiters over the tips, too.
I got fed up with it very quickly. After a while I was practically stuffing the pesos into the hands of the vendors saying, “Here, just *take* it already!”
Usually I’ll do all my research for the best prices before I hit the stores. Simple plan of attack - get in and get out.
Harrison McLeod’s last blog post..Fiction Writing: Playing Games
Barbara Swafford
on 25 Mar 2008 at 12:15 am #
Hi Lindsey and John,
This is a great post Lindsey, and hopefully we’ll be seeing more of you here.
I’m not a big negotiator, and I think it’s because we see the other side of it so much in business. We do excavation and often the customer starts a sentence with “While you’re here with that equipment………”, and the sentence is finished with what should be an “extra”. Most times we comply, however we react more favorably when they ask, “How much extra would it cost to move those rocks, or whatever…”. Then, we almost always say we will take care of it at no charge.
The first group gets the label as a “one of those “while you’re here” customers”.
Barbara Swafford’s last blog post..How Doing Laundry Inspires The NBOTW
Lindsey
on 25 Mar 2008 at 8:36 am #
My one experience with Mexico I found that I had to have my guy friends negotiate for me, because they didn’t haggle as much with the females.
I personally am an internet person so when I want something I search until I find a good deal. If it is something done in person I try to make sure John is there so he can use his skills for the better of our pocketbook.
@ Barbara - Thank you, I usually just help John with his posts but I had fun with this one so I am sure I will try it again!
I understand the point of view you have. I don’t have my own business but I am a wedding planner and brides ask for everything but want to pay nothing! I am a lot more willing to give them what they ask for if they are being reasonable and nice.
If someone says “I can’t believe you expect me to pay $800 for my wedding and you won’t even upgrade my room for me” they are not going to get any favors! That just makes me want to tell them, “I paid $25,000 for my wedding quit being cheap!”
John Hoff
on 25 Mar 2008 at 2:41 pm #
@ Harry - Your story reminds me of when we went to Hawaii a couple years ago. We walked down this shopping area with a bunch of Korean street vendors shouting out deals of the lifetime.
At first I negotiated to the point where I’d walk away and then they’d say, “ok.”
Cool, huh? Great deal! - I’d say.
Like you, after awhile I was like, ok ok, here - take it. Just give me the damn samurai knife (which is really cool and has a dragon on it).
@ Barbara - we get that in our landscape company. You’d think I’d learn. People do the exact same to us.
But I think it’s a little different when companies and contractors know you’re an investor. They see you in a different (more rich) way. I’m not a full time real estate investor but I do a little and I have learned that many contractors up their prices the second they find out this is an investment property.
They figure I’m Donald Trump or something. So in that way, I must talk them down otherwise I’m the fool.
John Hoff
on 25 Mar 2008 at 2:43 pm #
@ Harry - oh yeah, and unless that motorcycle fits two car seats, two diaper bags, and two other passengers, . . . ah what the heck - motorcycle it is! I need to cruise Red Rock Canyon and let loose.
Debbie Yost
on 27 Mar 2008 at 2:25 pm #
Lindsey,
I do not like to ask for anything. I leave a lot of that to my husband. I don’t even like to go car shopping. The last few cars we bought I only went in to sign the paperwork and approve the car. I hate the negotiation, but my husband doesn’t mind it. Of course, he’s an attorney so he enjoys a challenge. It makes me cringe just thinking about it. However, I agree that you won’t get it if you don’t ask and the worst thing they can say is no. I hope I usually fall in the the “what will it cost” category instead of the “gimme gimme gimme” category Barbara mentioned.
As for being a wedding planner, you are one brave soul. My husband tried to talk me into making wedding dresses and I told him I didn’t think I could deal with the bridezillas.
John,
I wanted to thank you for dropping by my blog and giving me a digg. I truly appreciate your support in this matter.
Debbie Yost’s last blog post..A Mother’s Tribute
Lindsey
on 27 Mar 2008 at 2:40 pm #
I have always been a little shy so that is why I make John do most of the negotiations…I will sometimes tell him what to ask for but usually don’t say it myself. However, the more you ask the easier it becomes.
Negotiations come easy for lawyers…one of the MANY reasons I am not one
As for wedding planning, you come across more nice brides than bridezillas but those few bridezillas can really ruin your mood!
John Hoff
on 27 Mar 2008 at 2:51 pm #
Sheesh - what’s with the wives leaving the husbands to do all the dirty work?
hehe
No problem about the Digg, Debbie. If anyone’s interested in what I dugg - click on Debbie’s last blog post. It’s pretty disturbing what some people will do for a laugh. Lindsey’s nephew has muscular dystrophy and if someone made fun of him for it - I’d tear their head off!
Nick Eubanks
on 28 Mar 2008 at 10:55 am #
John,
Thank you for your comment. This really is a great post and I hope I can help deliver the visibility it deserves. I look forward to more great stuff from EventureBiz.
Thanks again,
Nick Eubanks
Nick Eubanks’s last blog post..Everything is Negotiable - Get what you want
John Hoff
on 28 Mar 2008 at 10:59 am #
No problem Nick. Thanks for the link. I’m looking forward to swapping posts with you real soon.
As for the more great stuff, I’m about 10 minutes away from posting my next article.
Minnesota Investment Property
on 31 Mar 2008 at 7:49 am #
Excellent post. It is amazing that more of us don’t do this. I suppose it is cultural or politeness. But you are right, most people are willing to negotiate and take less for their services. I am making a commitment to do this every time I have the chance.
Scott
Minnesota Investment Property’s last blog post..Stupid Property Repairs #2
John Hoff
on 31 Mar 2008 at 11:10 am #
Hi Scott
Learning to negotiate isn’t something they teach you in school, maybe that’s why so many people either don’t think about it or are afraid of it. Obviously, as real estate investors we learn to negotiate early on or we fade away.
I like your last blog post’s title, that’s funny. I watch all those real estate shows on TV. My favorite is Property Ladder and my wife and I crack up with some of the big ideas people come up with.
But your website isn’t loading at the moment. I’ll check back later today.
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers
on 14 Apr 2008 at 5:05 pm #
Great advice, Lindsey, thank you! I think many people (including me) are reluctant to ask for things yet most of use are happy to help others when asked, so it’s a bit daft! I’ll remember this next time I am in a position to negotiate.
John, you’re so right! They don’t teach it in school yet it is such a great skill to have, I think they definitely should.
:o)
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers’s last blog post..Towards 2011
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers
on 14 Apr 2008 at 5:08 pm #
Haha! Only just noticed the pic … fantastic! And excellent caption! :o)
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers’s last blog post..Towards 2011
John Hoff
on 15 Apr 2008 at 8:48 am #
@Dianne - all you have to do is ask. The worst someone will say is, no.
For me, I’m very personable. I like talking with people and hearing their experiences that relate to my own. In that way, I learn.
When you get on a more personable level with sales people and contractors they tend to look at your requests in a more friendly way. That is, they see your requests like this: “I’ll try and help this guy out” opposed to “this customer is trying to get something for nothing.”
I’m not saying try to manipulate someone into getting what you want. I’m just saying sometimes a friendlier approach can create a win-win situation for everyone.
About Fluffy - that’s all on Lindsey. I love that pic, too, and it has inspired me to find relevant and entertaining pictures for my posts, though that won’t always be the case (the entertaining part).
John Hoff
on 15 Apr 2008 at 8:50 am #
Hey, maybe we should make Fluffy the eVentureBiz mascot or brand image!!!
What? You don’t want to host your website with us?????? LOL
Lindsey
on 15 Apr 2008 at 9:22 am #
I think most of us are so afraid to negotiate because our parents and grandparents never taught us that skill, it never used to be as necessary as it is today.
You just have to remember that a lot of business people expect you to negotiate. It makes it easier to ask for something if you know that it is a normal part of the process.
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers
on 17 Apr 2008 at 4:32 pm #
@John Win-win situations are definitely the best kind! And it’s true what you say, the worst thing someone will say is no. I must remember this!
Fluffy as brand mascot … LOL!
@ Lindsey “… a lot of business people expect you to negotiate.” That does make it much easier, knowing that, thank you!
:o)
Dianne Murphy-Rodgers’s last blog post..The Freelance Writing Learning Curve